Most physicians follow or supplement their clinical practice with physician leadership roles, and wind down their careers by scaling back to part time executives or clinical consultants before official retirement. Richard Afable, MD, MPH, FACP, suggests an alternative. After retiring from CEO and executive roles at several large health systems, Dr. Afable now advocates for community wellbeing and the development of others as the President and Board Chair of BeWellOC in Orange County. In this episode, we interview Dr. Afable about how physicians can (and should) plan for a type of “third career” - one that focuses on significance and service. He also shares concepts that physicians can consider as they work towards a retirement plan. 
 
Richard Afable, MD, MPH, FACP
President and Board Chair, Be Well Orange County, www.bewelloc.org
https://www.linkedin.com/in/richard-afable-m-d-mph-84722b162/
 

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An Alternative to Traditional Retirement: Considerations for Physicians

Richard Afable, MD, MPH, FACP

Self-Management

Self-Awareness

Motivations and Thinking Style

Adaptability

Pamela Sullivan, MD, MBA, CPE, is the author of the new book, Career Prescription Guide: A Physician's Guide for Career Transformation or Advancement. She is a national medical director, High-Risk Programs at P3 Health Partners and founder of National Healthcare Solutions LLC. Dr. Pamela Sullivan brings a career as varied as it is distinguished — from physical therapist to emergency medicine physician, urgent care pioneer, and now national leader in value-based care. In this episode, Dr. Sullivan shares her unconventional path through medicine, her hard-won perspective on patient-centered leadership, and her vision for what healthcare can and should be. 

Episode Highlights:

- Why Value-Based Care Works: When you do the right things for the patient, the financial outcomes follow. 
- What Emergency Medicine Taught Her About People: Years in a trauma center shaped Dr. Sullivan's view of compassion and human dignity. She reflects on shedding early biases, treating every patient — from hospital CEOs to the unhoused — with equal respect. 
- The Public's Eroding Trust in Healthcare: Dr. Sullivan speaks candidly about experiencing healthcare inequities firsthand. She advocates strongly for universal access to healthcare and its core components, and acknowledges the complex, multi-layered challenges. 
- Reasons for Hope: Dr. Sullivan highlights home-based care models as a meaningful step forward. 
- Advice for Early-Career Physicians: Medicine is just one piece of what new physicians need to master. Dr. Sullivan urges young physicians to give themselves grace, invest in mentors, treat every member of the care team with dignity, and immerse themselves in their organization's culture.

Packed with wisdom for early-career physicians and insights into compassion-centered leadership, this episode is a must-listen for anyone passionate about creating a better healthcare future.

Learn more about the American Association for Physician Leadership at www.physicianleaders.org.


Driving Value-Based Care by Putting Patients First with Dr. Pamela Sullivan

Pamela C. Sullivan, MD, MBA, CPE, FACP, FCUCM, PT

Finance

Economics

Problem Solving

Action Orientation

Join host Mike Sacopulos for a compelling conversation with Michael S. Hein, MD, MS, MHCM, PCC, senior vice president and executive coach, MEDI Leadership, about his new book, Shifting Towards Unorthodoxy. Drawing on nearly four decades in healthcare — from competitive swimming coach to general internist, CMO, CEO, and now executive leadership coach — Hein tackles a question that haunted him throughout his career: Why is healthcare leadership so difficult?

In this episode, he introduces the crucial distinction between complicated and complex systems, explores how industrial-age mindsets contribute to burnout and suffering, and shares practical insights from coaching hundreds of healthcare leaders across the country.

- How mental models and beliefs shape thinking, which determines actions and results

- The difference between being a "hero leader" versus a "gardener leader"

- Why shifting mindsets is uncomfortable — and connects to our deepest beliefs about reality

- What healthcare executives and competitive athletes have in common

Shifting Towards Unorthodoxy by Michael S. Hein, MD, — an invitation to think differently about healthcare leadership and an introduction to navigating complexity in organizational life.

Learn more about the American Association for Physician Leadership at www.physicianleaders.org.


Why Healthcare Leadership Is So Hard — And What to Do About It

Michael S. Hein, MD, MS, MHCM, PCC

Strategy and Innovation

Environmental Influences

Professional Capabilities

Accountability

Resilience

Join host Mike Sacopulos for an eye-opening conversation with Hugo Huang about the financial realities of adopting generative AI in healthcare organizations. Drawing from his Harvard Business Review article "What CEOs Need to Know About the Costs of Adopting Gen AI," Hugo explains why many companies are pulling back from AI implementation due to unexpected cost pressures — and what leaders can do to avoid these pitfalls. From understanding the difference between predictive and generative AI to navigating infrastructure bottlenecks and the emerging "diamond-shaped" organizational structure, this episode provides practical guidance for healthcare executives navigating the complex landscape of AI adoption.

Hugo Huang, MBA, is an expert in cloud computing and business models who works with Canonical, a leading provider of infrastructure technology for Google's cloud business. He discusses building your AI cost dashboard, top metrics CEOs should track for AI spending visibility, understanding consumption patterns to estimate future costs, and getting started safely on AI.

"What CEOs Need to Know About the Costs of Adopting Gen AI" by Hugo Huang, published in Harvard Business Review and featured for members of the American Association for Physician Leadership. https://www.physicianleaders.org/articles/what-ceos-need-to-know-about-the-costs-of-adopting-genai

Learn more about the American Association for Physician Leadership at www.physicianleaders.org.

The Hidden Costs of Generative AI: What Healthcare Leaders Need to Know

Hugo Huang

Operations and Policy

Technology Integration

Critical Appraisal Skills

In this deeply moving episode of SoundPractice, host Mike Sacopulos sits down with Louis M. Profeta, MD, a clinical instructor of emergency medicine at Indiana University and Marian University Schools of Medicine, bestselling author, and speaker.

Profeta shares his unconventional path to medicine — from a catastrophic neck injury that ended his Olympic dreams to choosing his college based on a basketball game. He candidly admits he initially pursued medicine for financial security, but along the way discovered a profound calling in emergency medicine, which he describes as "the most spiritual and enlightening environment in healthcare."

The conversation explores the unique position of the ER as society's great equalizer, where everyone from premature babies to Fortune 500 CEOs receive care under one roof. Profeta discusses how emergency departments serve as early warning systems for societal crises — from the fentanyl epidemic to homelessness — often sounding alarms years before mainstream attention arrives.

The episode's most powerful message centers on Profeta's philosophy captured in his article "These Four Words That May Offend You May Also Just Save You" — the understanding that being a physician is what you do, not who you are. He advocates prioritizing family and personal life over professional identity as the key to career longevity and genuine patient care.

Profeta offers a refreshingly honest and deeply human perspective on what it means to sustain a career in medicine while maintaining your soul.

Learn more about the American Association for Physician Leadership at www.physicianleaders.org


The ER as America's Mirror: 37 Years on the Front Lines with Dr. Louis Profeta

Louis M. Profeta, MD

Influence

Quality and Risk

Healthcare Process

Mike Sacopulos speaks with Jordan Grumet, MD, associate medical director of Unity Hospice, podcaster, and author of The Purpose Code. Grumet shares his deeply personal journey from burning out as an internal medicine physician to finding fulfillment in hospice care, and explains how his work with dying patients has revealed profound lessons about living with purpose.

Most people get purpose wrong, Grumet argues. Rather than being your "why" in life — some grand, audacious mission — purpose is simply the actions you take in the present and future that light you up. This reframe makes purpose abundant rather than anxiety-inducing.

Working with dying patients has taught Grumet that the key question to ask yourself is: "If I were on my deathbed tomorrow, what would I regret never having the energy, courage, or time to do?" The answers reveal your true purpose anchors.

"You don't find your purpose. You build or create it."

Looking ahead, Grumet previews his upcoming AAPL book, The Healthcare Heist, which examines how third parties have leveraged the healthcare system and explores potential solutions.

Learn more about the American Association for Physician Leadership at www.physicianleaders.org.


Finding Purpose: Dr. Jordan Grumet on Burnout, Meaning, and the Deathbed Test

Jordan Grumet, MD

In this enlightening episode, Mike Sacopulos sits down with three visionary leaders from the American Association for Physician Leadership (AAPL) — Peter Angood, MD, president and CEO, Joe LiVigni, senior vice president of education, and Devin Glasgo, director of consumer experience and development — to discuss the groundbreaking launch of AAPL Helix.

AAPL Helix is a comprehensive learning ecosystem designed to redefine how physician leaders develop their skills throughout their careers. From AI-powered personalized learning to seamless community integration, this platform is more than just a tool — it’s a transformational approach to professional development that transcends traditional CME credit tracking.

In this episode, you will explore:

- The "Leadership is Learned" Philosophy
- Beyond Transactional CME: A Transformational Ecosystem
- AI-Powered Personalization
- Competency-Based Learning Journeys
- Streamlined User Experience
- Community Integration
- The Vision Forward

Dr. Angood envisions Helix as the core of AAPL's evolution — supporting not only individual physician development but also institutional clients and expanding into inter-professional leadership development. With a legacy spanning 50 years, AAPL is positioned to lead healthcare transformation by strengthening the patient-physician relationship and empowering physicians as natural stewards of industry improvement.

Don’t miss this fascinating conversation about how innovative technology is reshaping leadership in healthcare.

Learn more about AAPL Helix at www.physicianleaders.org


AAPL Helix: Transforming Physician Leadership Development Through Innovative Technology

Peter B. Angood, MD, FRCS(C), FACS, MCCM, FAAPL(Hon)

Joe LiVigni

Devin Glasgo

Motivate Others

An Alternative to Traditional Retirement: Considerations for Physicians

RECENT EPISODES

Driving Value-Based Care by Putting Patients First with Dr. Pamela Sullivan

Why Healthcare Leadership Is So Hard — And What to Do About It

The Hidden Costs of Generative AI: What Healthcare Leaders Need to Know

The ER as America's Mirror: 37 Years on the Front Lines with Dr. Louis Profeta

Finding Purpose: Dr. Jordan Grumet on Burnout, Meaning, and the Deathbed Test

AAPL Helix: Transforming Physician Leadership Development Through Innovative Technology

RELATED EPISODES

Driving Value-Based Care by Putting Patients First with Dr. Pamela Sullivan

Finding Purpose: Dr. Jordan Grumet on Burnout, Meaning, and the Deathbed Test

AAPL Helix: Transforming Physician Leadership Development Through Innovative Technology

Harnessing Exam Room Experience for Leadership Excellence with Dr. Hanah Polotsky and Lisa Williams

Relational Leadership with Sarah Smithson, MD, MPH, and Kyle Turner, PharmD

Dr. Jenna Miller and New Book on Navigating Your Fertility as a Woman in Medicine