We have all seen the statistics on physician burnout. We all know of physicians that have changed course mid-career. Moving away from a clinical practice is not something to be done without planning. Sylvie Stacy, MD, MPH has written, “50 Nonclinical Careers for Physicians: Fulfilling, Meaningful, and Lucrative Alternatives to Direct Patient Care." This episode of SoundPractice examines career options and motivations for change with Dr. Stacy. If you are planning a career change or know someone who is, join us for some long term strategic planning!
Sylvie Stacy, MD, MPHhttps://shop.physicianleaders.org/collections/books/products/50-nonclinical-careers-for-physicians-fulfilling-meaningful-and-lucrative-alternatives-to-direct-patient-care 
@LookForZebrashttps://www.linkedin.com/company/lookforzebras/
www.lookforzebras.com
 

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Pivoting, Tapping Out or Trading Up:  Physicians Transitioning to Nonclinical Careers

Sylvie Stacy, MD, MPH

Self-Management

Self-Awareness

Professional Capabilities

Influence

Strategy and Innovation

Environmental Influences

In this episode of SoundPractice, host Mike Sacopulos speaks with two physician-researchers whose landmark study is sounding an early warning about the long-term consequences of state abortion restrictions on the U.S. physician workforce. Anisha Ganguly, MD, MPH, assistant professor of medicine at the University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill, and Anna Morenz, MD, MPH, assistant clinical professor of internal medicine at the University of Arizona, discuss their study published in JAMA Network Open in March 2026.

Their study analyzed nearly 24.2 million residency applications submitted to more than 4,300 programs across all medical specialties between the 2018–2019 and 2022–2023 application cycles. Using an interrupted time-series causal methodology developed in collaboration with health economist Anirban Basu, PhD, MS, at the University of Washington, the team found that applications to programs in states enacting new abortion restrictions after Dobbs dropped significantly — among both male and female applicants.

Among the conversation’s most striking moments: Ganguly reveals that the decline among men applicants was larger than expected — and larger than they had originally hypothesized. She and Morenz discuss why this makes Dobbs an “all of us” problem, not just a women’s issue, and what it signals about the broader reproductive climate of restricted states. 

The episode also covers the pipeline problem: because more than half of physicians ultimately practice in the state where they trained, sustained declines in application volume could worsen existing physician shortages in primary care and emergency medicine in restricted states for years to come. Morenz shares a timely update: in the most recent March 2026 match cycle, two OB-GYN residency programs — both in Texas — failed to fill all their slots.

Study Reference:
Ganguly AP, Basu A, Morenz AM. State-Level Disparities in Residency Applications After Dobbs v Jackson Women’s Health Organization. JAMA Netw Open. 2026;9(3):e260286. doi:10.1001/jamanetworkopen.2026.0286

Learn more about the American Association for Physician Leadership at www.physicianleaders.org.


Where Will Doctors Train? Residency Applications, Abortion Restrictions, and the Coming Workforce Crisis with Dr. Anisha Ganguly & Dr. Anna Morenz

Anisha Ganguly, MD, MPH

Anna Morenz, MD, MPH

Quality and Risk

Quality Improvement

What does commanding troops in combat have to do with leading a hospital? More than you might think. In this episode of SoundPractice, host Mike Sacopulos sits down with Lt. Gen. Mark Hertling, U.S. Army (Ret) — former commander of U.S. Army Forces in Europe, CNN military analyst — to explore the surprising parallels between military and medical leadership. Soldiers and physicians share more in common than most realize. Both are defined by their profession first, and both operate in life-and-death environments where leadership is not optional.

Hertling shares how he came to spend nearly a decade at AdventHealth developing physician leadership programs, what his doctoral research revealed about inter-professional training, and why getting doctors, nurses, and administrators in the same room may be the single most important thing hospitals can do. Inter-professional leadership training produces measurably better outcomes than siloed programs.

He also discusses his newly released memoir, If I Don't Return: A Father's Wartime Journal, drawn from a handwritten journal he kept during Operation Desert Storm.

Learn more about the American Association for Physician Leadership at www.physicianleaders.org.


From Battlefield to Bedside: Physician Leadership Lessons from Lt. Gen. Mark Hertling

Mark Hertling, DBA

Accountability

Motivations and Thinking Style

Comfort with Visibility

What does it mean to truly flourish at work — and why are physician leaders especially vulnerable to losing that?

In this episode of SoundPractice, host Mike Sacopulos sits down with MaryCay Durrant, a nationally recognized expert on human fulfillment whose 30-year career has taken her inside transformation efforts at Deloitte, Pepsi, Johnson & Johnson, Hyatt, and — increasingly — the world of healthcare and physician leadership. MaryCay brings a perspective that is part organizational science, part nature wisdom, and entirely focused on helping leaders rediscover what fuels them. Her approach helps human beings flourish at work. 

The conversation moves from the personal — MaryCay's father was a pediatrician and president of the American College of Physician Executives — to the deeply practical, as she walks through her WORK model, a framework for combating burnout through small, consistent adjustments rather than wholesale system overhaul.  As she describes in two compelling case studies, meaningful change happens through small communities of practice — not top-down mandates.

Learn more about the American Association for Physician Leadership at www.physicianleaders.org.


How Physician Leaders Can Rediscover Their Human Spirit with MaryCay Durrant

MaryCay Durrant

Resilience

Humility

Pamela Sullivan, MD, MBA, CPE, is the author of the new book, Career Prescription Guide: A Physician's Guide for Career Transformation or Advancement. She is a national medical director, High-Risk Programs at P3 Health Partners and founder of National Healthcare Solutions LLC. Dr. Pamela Sullivan brings a career as varied as it is distinguished — from physical therapist to emergency medicine physician, urgent care pioneer, and now national leader in value-based care. In this episode, Dr. Sullivan shares her unconventional path through medicine, her hard-won perspective on patient-centered leadership, and her vision for what healthcare can and should be. 

Episode Highlights:

- Why Value-Based Care Works: When you do the right things for the patient, the financial outcomes follow. 
- What Emergency Medicine Taught Her About People: Years in a trauma center shaped Dr. Sullivan's view of compassion and human dignity. She reflects on shedding early biases, treating every patient — from hospital CEOs to the unhoused — with equal respect. 
- The Public's Eroding Trust in Healthcare: Dr. Sullivan speaks candidly about experiencing healthcare inequities firsthand. She advocates strongly for universal access to healthcare and its core components, and acknowledges the complex, multi-layered challenges. 
- Reasons for Hope: Dr. Sullivan highlights home-based care models as a meaningful step forward. 
- Advice for Early-Career Physicians: Medicine is just one piece of what new physicians need to master. Dr. Sullivan urges young physicians to give themselves grace, invest in mentors, treat every member of the care team with dignity, and immerse themselves in their organization's culture.

Packed with wisdom for early-career physicians and insights into compassion-centered leadership, this episode is a must-listen for anyone passionate about creating a better healthcare future.

Learn more about the American Association for Physician Leadership at www.physicianleaders.org.


Driving Value-Based Care by Putting Patients First with Dr. Pamela Sullivan

Pamela C. Sullivan, MD, MBA, CPE, FACP, FCUCM, PT

Finance

Economics

Problem Solving

Action Orientation

Join host Mike Sacopulos for a compelling conversation with Michael S. Hein, MD, MS, MHCM, PCC, senior vice president and executive coach, MEDI Leadership, about his new book, Shifting Towards Unorthodoxy. Drawing on nearly four decades in healthcare — from competitive swimming coach to general internist, CMO, CEO, and now executive leadership coach — Hein tackles a question that haunted him throughout his career: Why is healthcare leadership so difficult?

In this episode, he introduces the crucial distinction between complicated and complex systems, explores how industrial-age mindsets contribute to burnout and suffering, and shares practical insights from coaching hundreds of healthcare leaders across the country.

- How mental models and beliefs shape thinking, which determines actions and results

- The difference between being a "hero leader" versus a "gardener leader"

- Why shifting mindsets is uncomfortable — and connects to our deepest beliefs about reality

- What healthcare executives and competitive athletes have in common

Shifting Towards Unorthodoxy by Michael S. Hein, MD, — an invitation to think differently about healthcare leadership and an introduction to navigating complexity in organizational life.

Learn more about the American Association for Physician Leadership at www.physicianleaders.org.


Why Healthcare Leadership Is So Hard — And What to Do About It

Michael S. Hein, MD, MS, MHCM, PCC

Join host Mike Sacopulos for an eye-opening conversation with Hugo Huang about the financial realities of adopting generative AI in healthcare organizations. Drawing from his Harvard Business Review article "What CEOs Need to Know About the Costs of Adopting Gen AI," Hugo explains why many companies are pulling back from AI implementation due to unexpected cost pressures — and what leaders can do to avoid these pitfalls. From understanding the difference between predictive and generative AI to navigating infrastructure bottlenecks and the emerging "diamond-shaped" organizational structure, this episode provides practical guidance for healthcare executives navigating the complex landscape of AI adoption.

Hugo Huang, MBA, is an expert in cloud computing and business models who works with Canonical, a leading provider of infrastructure technology for Google's cloud business. He discusses building your AI cost dashboard, top metrics CEOs should track for AI spending visibility, understanding consumption patterns to estimate future costs, and getting started safely on AI.

"What CEOs Need to Know About the Costs of Adopting Gen AI" by Hugo Huang, published in Harvard Business Review and featured for members of the American Association for Physician Leadership. https://www.physicianleaders.org/articles/what-ceos-need-to-know-about-the-costs-of-adopting-genai

Learn more about the American Association for Physician Leadership at www.physicianleaders.org.

Pivoting, Tapping Out or Trading Up: Physicians Transitioning to Nonclinical Careers

RECENT EPISODES

Where Will Doctors Train? Residency Applications, Abortion Restrictions, and the Coming Workforce Crisis with Dr. Anisha Ganguly & Dr. Anna Morenz

From Battlefield to Bedside: Physician Leadership Lessons from Lt. Gen. Mark Hertling

How Physician Leaders Can Rediscover Their Human Spirit with MaryCay Durrant

Driving Value-Based Care by Putting Patients First with Dr. Pamela Sullivan

Why Healthcare Leadership Is So Hard — And What to Do About It

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Driving Value-Based Care by Putting Patients First with Dr. Pamela Sullivan

Where Will Doctors Train? Residency Applications, Abortion Restrictions, and the Coming Workforce Crisis with Dr. Anisha Ganguly & Dr. Anna Morenz

Why Healthcare Leadership Is So Hard — And What to Do About It